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Fletchery and Bowyery

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yoda6519
663179.  Thu Jan 28, 2010 1:29 pm Reply with quote

Efros wrote:
mckeonj wrote:
gerontius grumpus wrote:
Fletchers make arrows and bowyers make sausages.

What do thatchers make?


Wonderful targets come the revolution




The advent of compound bows with mechanical advantage means that the archer is no longer required to pull 40 - 50 lbs for every arrow but can with the correct setup get away with a lower hold weight.


i have to differ m8, my compound bow is a 57lbs draw weight, true i don't need to hold it at that weight but i still need to draw it.

my mongolian bow is set at 38lbs (i think) which i draw and hold til loose.

 
Efros
663196.  Thu Jan 28, 2010 2:05 pm Reply with quote

What is the effective weight exerted on the release? i.e. what's your mechanical advantage?

 
yoda6519
664807.  Mon Feb 01, 2010 12:36 pm Reply with quote

Efros wrote:
What is the effective weight exerted on the release? i.e. what's your mechanical advantage?


don't know about that m8, i know the arrow leaves the bow at approx 264fps (there's prob an equation to work it out but i wouldn't have a clue lol)

the point was that i am still drawing 58lbs when i pull it back, all the cams are doing is enabling me to hold it at about 30-40 lbs when it hits the valley after i have fully drawn it allowing me to aim without holding 58lbs before the loose.

 
Efros
664891.  Mon Feb 01, 2010 3:19 pm Reply with quote

So about 2:1, my point, admittedly not very well made, was that with older style bows you would be drawing and holding 58lbs, which for a round of say 12 dozen arrows is pretty tiring.

 
yoda6519
665359.  Tue Feb 02, 2010 3:29 pm Reply with quote

ah, i see what you mean now, but the main point is with a traditianal bow ie longbow, mongolian or even a warbow you don't hold it. you draw and loose instinctively on your target.
through experience you get to know where to aim during the draw and the loose.

you wouldn't be holding the bow at full draw for more than a second at most.

as shown by kassai lajos here m8

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NOpOqgotJZc

 
Tas
665471.  Tue Feb 02, 2010 6:49 pm Reply with quote

Holding a traditional longbow at full draw for anything more than half to three quarters of a second (when loosing multiple shafts over time, as opposed to single shafts and then resting) is:

A: Knackering
B: Strains the back and shoulders, inducing shaking and
C: As a result of B, accuracy is impaired.

:-)

 
Efros
665497.  Tue Feb 02, 2010 7:31 pm Reply with quote

You're very correct Tas, I was speaking more about competition recurve bows rather than the longbow, some of those brought up from the Mary Rose were found to have incredible draw weights ranging from 60 to 80 lbs, making a hold before release a painful exercise, but then the accuracy required of a combat archer was somewhat different to that of a competition target or field archer.

 
Alfred E Neuman
665556.  Wed Feb 03, 2010 1:32 am Reply with quote

Is there any difference in effort required (for the same effect) between a recurve bow and a long bow? I have always assumed them to be the same with the recurve having the advantage of being a lot smaller, but I've never had anything to base that assumption on.

 
Efros
665632.  Wed Feb 03, 2010 5:42 am Reply with quote

Historically I believe the advantage of the recurve was that it could be easily used by mounted archers due to its compact dimensions. Recurves were I believe used as a closer quarter weapon than the longbow.

 
Tas
665671.  Wed Feb 03, 2010 6:39 am Reply with quote

Recurves have a much flatter trajectory (over short distances) and are alot harder to pull. They do have a comparable range to a longbow, but tended to be used at closer quarters due to the speed of the horses (closing the gap to the enemy, who were normally other horse archers. Fast moving targets being harder to hit, and could easily steer their steeds away from the arrows).
Some of the Warbows brought up from the Mary Rose had draw weights of well over 100lbs (one was tested to destruction, and I will have to look for the details).

 
Tas
665675.  Wed Feb 03, 2010 6:43 am Reply with quote

Aha.....this looks intersting, although I suspect some of the figures are a little high (and possibly show the extreme maximum draw weight used to destroy the bow that was tested)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/English_longbow#Draw_weights

When I was in an archery troop, we typically used 65-80lb draw weight Longbows.

:-)

 
Efros
666047.  Wed Feb 03, 2010 4:07 pm Reply with quote

Sounds about right, the one my granddad made was about 78lbs at 28". He also made one of these



His was different from the original Chinese version in that it fired three bolts at a time rather than 2 and it took 24 bolts in the magazine.

 
Ion Zone
666131.  Wed Feb 03, 2010 6:04 pm Reply with quote

Quote:
Is there any difference in effort required (for the same effect) between a recurve bow and a long bow?


Modern recurves are smoother, though it depends. Shooting a classical longbow, you feel like you are holding a balista. I have never tried a classical recurve.

Normally I shoot barebow recurve in a longbow style, which is very unusual in a club (the draw weight is 40lb at 28 inches). I've also shot a stirrup crossbow.

 
Tas
666288.  Thu Feb 04, 2010 6:09 am Reply with quote

I've used a Mongolian recurve (made from animal horn etc) and it is a LOT harder to pull. The draw weight was less than that of my own longbow, but because the limbs are shorter, and you are working against the recurve, it feels alot harder to do.

:-)

 
Ion Zone
666639.  Thu Feb 04, 2010 5:44 pm Reply with quote

At a guess, a 30lb longbow feels about as heavy as a 40lb fibreglass bow, but it is a much slower draw. Modern wooden bows are easier, lemonwood, for example, is much nicer to shoot.

 

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