View previous topic | View next topic

England

Page 1 of 2
Goto page 1, 2  Next

Dr Hudebnik
147942.  Fri Feb 16, 2007 10:56 am Reply with quote

What is the earliest source of the word 'England'?

 
grizzly
147946.  Fri Feb 16, 2007 11:18 am Reply with quote

wiki says:

wiki wrote:
England became a unified state during the 10th century and takes its name from the Angles — one of a number of Germanic tribes who settled in the territory during the 5th and 6th centuries


As ever when wiki has something interesting to say, there isn't a cited source but this is something that is widely known.

 
suze
147949.  Fri Feb 16, 2007 11:26 am Reply with quote

I'll open with 890.

One of the first works of English history was Historia ecclesiastica gentis Anglorum, written in Latin by the Venerable Bede around 730. This work was translated into English sometime around 890, and the translation is conventionally ascribed to Alfred the Great.

It includes the line

"on ðam mynstre Æbbercurnig, ðæt is geseted on Englalande"

(It refers to the monastery at Abercorn near Bo'ness in Scotland; I don't know much OE so I'll look to someone else for a full translation.)


Well there's an opening bid - anyone care to raise (or rather lower, but you know what I mean)?

 
ali
147955.  Fri Feb 16, 2007 11:38 am Reply with quote

I'll go with 890 as well. The Anglo-Saxon Chronicle (c. 890) mentions , in an entry for the year 876, the army of the Danes in England (I don't have access to an original text - sorry).

 
Dr Hudebnik
147961.  Fri Feb 16, 2007 11:49 am Reply with quote

Suze – brilliant! Thanks. This is just the sort of thing I like to learn. I'm also delighted that my browser showed the OE characters correctly. I'm always hesitant to use Czech diacritics for that very reason.

A long time ago, in a galaxy far, far way, I did a term of OE at university. I remember something about a green giant and a pearl...

 
suze
147965.  Fri Feb 16, 2007 12:02 pm Reply with quote

Dr Hudebnik, you should be fine with Czech diacritics here - they only need Latin Extended-A and all the mainstream Roman alphabet fonts in common use today include the 128 characters of that block, so no-one should have any trouble seeing them.


Lucky you, getting to take OE for a term! I never did, and the little I know was learned incidental to other things. Middle English, yes - it's hard to avoid Chaucer altogether.

 
ali
147972.  Fri Feb 16, 2007 12:19 pm Reply with quote

I think that the poems you allude to are actually Middle English. They both appear on the same MS (Cotton Nero A.x) and are dated to around 1400.
Here is the text of the MS (containing the poems Pearl, Cleanness, Patience and Sir Gawain and the Green Knight).
The knight was of gigantic stature for those wondering where the green giant comes in.

Hope this helps

 
Dr Hudebnik
147975.  Fri Feb 16, 2007 12:31 pm Reply with quote

Sorry Ali, I was being is little bit facetious. I do remember the works, of course, but not in great detail.

Best,

 
ali
147983.  Fri Feb 16, 2007 12:41 pm Reply with quote

No worries, it was interesting checking the details.

 
AnneB
441116.  Mon Nov 17, 2008 10:54 am Reply with quote

Dr Hudebnik wrote:


A long time ago, in a galaxy far, far way, I did a term of OE at university. I remember something about a green giant and a pearl...


I too got a semester of OE, which I loved. I still have my Bright's Old English, which I haul out frequently for use in messing up students' brains.

 
ChristopherRobin
588084.  Wed Jul 22, 2009 10:17 am Reply with quote

The Chinese term for an English person is 英国人 (Yīngguórén). Although it literally means “brave country person”, it must be noted that the source of the name is primarily phonetic. The Chinese word for “brave” (yīng) merely stands for the [ɪŋ] sound in the the name “England”.

 
Zebra57
822808.  Fri Jun 10, 2011 9:19 am Reply with quote

Why does not England have a public holiday on its patron saint's day? Ireland does and it looks as if Scotland and Wales are moving towards a similar situation. Why not celebrate St Edmund's Day (November 20th) as he was the patron saint of England before the Norman elite installed St George. It avoids Easter/May Day and gives a bank holiday in the Autumn.

England is said to lack a national identity. People question what is culturally English? Irish, Scottish and Welsh cultural traditions are easily identified.

890AD suggested by Suze is as good a starting point as any other as England finally consolidated into a sort of political entity. What traditions then have we got to celebrate for 1121 years? Any suggestions?

 
CB27
822863.  Fri Jun 10, 2011 11:35 am Reply with quote

Give it a couple of years and we can have a Fibonacci anniversary.



Oh god, I am such a geek sometimes...

 
sjb
822890.  Fri Jun 10, 2011 2:55 pm Reply with quote

lol

 
Moosh
822961.  Sat Jun 11, 2011 2:48 am Reply with quote

Zebra57 wrote:
Why does not England have a public holiday on its patron saint's day? Ireland does and it looks as if Scotland and Wales are moving towards a similar situation. Why not celebrate St Edmund's Day (November 20th) as he was the patron saint of England before the Norman elite installed St George. It avoids Easter/May Day and gives a bank holiday in the Autumn.

England is said to lack a national identity. People question what is culturally English? Irish, Scottish and Welsh cultural traditions are easily identified.

Why does England need a national identity? Not to sound like bobwilson here, but I find the idea that 50 million people have anything significant in common just because they happen to live on the same island absurd.

Smaller areas like the Home Counties or the North East I could see as having some kind of cohesive identity, but not for England as a whole.

 

Page 1 of 2
Goto page 1, 2  Next

All times are GMT - 5 Hours


Display posts from previous:   

Search Search Forums

Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2002 phpBB Group