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Living with an Electric Car

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PDR
1386303.  Thu Jul 29, 2021 12:11 pm Reply with quote

Still driving? I'd be surprised if you've got out of the traffic jam on the A5 by then...

PDR

 
dr.bob
1386347.  Fri Jul 30, 2021 9:36 am Reply with quote

crissdee wrote:
The cheapest they recommend is the MINI Electric at £26,000. In my current position, and in any foreseeable future position, this might as well be £26,000,000,000.


You're doubtless not the only person in that position. Other people have talked about the second-hand EV market, so I'll focus on a different aspect.

In the US and Europe, traditional car manufacturers have deliberately targeted the high-end of the market with their new EVs, presumably because that's where they can make the most profit. It's noticeable that there are no readily available budget EVs.

The situation in China is rather different. Car manufacturers over there are also developing EVs, though their customer base are not as wealthy, so there's a strong pressure to develop budget cars. The first meaningful effort is the Wuling Hongguang Mini EV. There are obvious problems with this car, the most obvious being the fact that it's pug ugly. The range is also poor. However, trailblazers always look primitive compared to later models that are subsequently developed.

The cost in China is apparently just £3,400, though a European version is apparently going to be sold at Ä9,999. Either way, this is doubtless just the first foray into the world of budget EVs. Hopefully, with the amount of R&D cash that's been diverted from Diesel cars into EVs, batteries will continue to become better and cheaper, helping prices drop even further.

 
Jenny
1386371.  Fri Jul 30, 2021 2:14 pm Reply with quote

dr.bob wrote:
Hopefully, with the amount of R&D cash that's been diverted from Diesel cars into EVs, batteries will continue to become better and cheaper, helping prices drop even further.


This is essentially my hope for EVs. The problems I foresee in making their use widespread are:

* the availability of raw materials currently used in batteries, which is likely to run into the same problem as the use of fossil fuels in that supplies may well disappear or become prohibitively expensive.

* the availability of power generated in a sustainable fashion to support the increased demand for electricity.

* the availability of raw materials for building cars and building roads, both of which use fossil fuels.

* the availability of places for people who don't live somewhere they can park a car and charge it readily overnight.

* the technology of fast-charging cars or making readily-changeable batteries isn't there yet.

* and of course the problem of range - current range is fine for people like me who don't often drive beyond the range of currently available vehicles, but many people drive a lot more than I do.

 
crissdee
1386374.  Fri Jul 30, 2021 2:23 pm Reply with quote

This is another thing from the same article. According to the figures they give, if you own an Audi e-tron GT, and can access the best public charger (150kw), then 30 minutes of charging will enable your car to travel 213 miles. I spent no more than 5 minutes fuelling my car in Ipswich the other week, and that took me 435 miles.

Obviously my 50+ litres of petrol cost far more than 30 mins of 150kw electricity, but it meant that I could drive from Ipswich to Harlow, Harlow to Bexleyheath, Bexleyheath to Harlow, Harlow to Builth Wells, Builth Wells to Hereford, and then Hereford to Builth Wells, before I needed to find a petrol station again.

 
barbados
1386382.  Sat Jul 31, 2021 3:07 am Reply with quote

The other alternative is to get one of these
[img] https://media.whatcar.com/400x300/wc-image/2021-04/mirai_18.04.21_leebrimble_192.jpg[/img]
That takes around 5 mins to recharge, and has a range of between 3-500 miles.
Itís also cleaner than the Audi e-tron it has performance to match a 2l 5 series BMW although this one comes with working indicators.
And with a single gear CVT drive chain, you get a smoother ride.

 
crissdee
1386385.  Sat Jul 31, 2021 5:23 am Reply with quote

barbados wrote:
The other alternative is to get one of these

That takes around 5 mins to recharge, and has a range of between 3-500 miles.
Itís also cleaner than the Audi e-tron it has performance to match a 2l 5 series BMW although this one comes with working indicators.
And with a single gear CVT drive chain, you get a smoother ride.


There was a superfluous space in that link...

 
PDR
1386393.  Sat Jul 31, 2021 7:55 am Reply with quote

barbados wrote:
The other alternative is to get one of these
[...]
Itís also cleaner than the Audi e-tron


That's not a straightforward parameter to establish, because it depends how the hydrogen was made. If the hydrogen was produced by electrolysis using power from a coal-fired power station* then its going to be dirtier than a 1950s Fordson tractor!

Quote:
it has performance to match a 2l 5 series BMW


I think you must have misread that whatcar article - what it actually said was:

Autocar wrote:
Thereís no getting around the fact that, with a 0-62mph time of 9.0secs, the Toyota Mirai isnít the quickest luxury car around. In fact, the 178bhp produced by its electric motor canít even match the performance of a base 2.0-litre diesel version of the BMW 5 Series. For the price of the Mirai, there are an awful lot of faster alternatives, including the Tesla Model 3.


Quote:
And with a single gear CVT drive chain, you get a smoother ride.


It's not a CVT drivetrain - it's a fixed-ratio direct drive transmission like all electric cars. Variable-ratio transmissions (whether with gearboxes or CVT systems) are required to mitigate the non-flat torque curve which is a pretty inherent feature of infernal combustion engines. Electric motors have flat torque curves and so don't need variable transmissions in the same sense.

PDR

* Which is still true for ~66% of chinese electricity with a carbon intensity of over 700g of CO2 per kWh, but it's still 182g/kWh for the UK and both of these are averages. In both countries short-term demand top-up is entirely fossil-based. Of course both of tehse are on a downward trend, but I suspect it will be a decade or five yet before the carbon content is negligible

 

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