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Industrial Society Destroys Mind and Environment

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Jenny
912279.  Mon May 28, 2012 1:16 pm Reply with quote

sushil_yadav wrote:

Iraq has got Weapons of Mass Destruction.....Why????......Because "Coalition of the Willing" cannot be wrong......If "Coalition of the Willing" says Iraq has got Weapons of Mass Destruction it has to be true.


I think you'll find that ship sailed a long time ago. It's probably at least eight or nine years since it was seriously claimed that Iraq had WMD. It was clearly a pretext for American invasion to protect their oil interests. The source of the WTC attacks was clearly from Saudia Arabia and not Iraq. On the other hand, ask yourself if the Iraqis would have preferred to hang on to Saddam Hussein's regime, even though many if not most were very very unhappy with American occupation.

sushil_yadav wrote:
Taliban and Al Qaeda are terrorists.......Not America / West which first created Taliban and Al Qaeda to fight against Russia in Afghanistan........and then sustained them for decades by giving them weapons and money.


Is this supposed to be news to us? Nobody is arguing that America and other western nations did not essentially create and support the Taliban and Al Qaeda in the beginning. On the other hand, ask yourself how many American suicide bombers there have been. Ask yourself who has suffered most from the actions of the Taliban and Al Qaeda in the last eight years or so. Are you arguing that Afghan citizens have greater freedom of movement and choice under Taliban rule than under American occupation? Well the Americans are pulling most of their troops out in the not too distant future so I guess we'll find out.


sushil_yadav wrote:

Pakistan is the root of terrorism........Not Britain which first destroyed India with 200 years of occupation and then carved out the state of Pakistan before leaving India.


Destroyed India? You mean that unifying a country into the strongest democracy in the east rather than a collection of warring princedoms is destruction? And then did the Indians actually have to drive the British out, or did they fairly politely ask the British to leave and then the British went?

And given that the Hindus and the Muslims seem fairly unable to agree to tolerate each other within the same society - indeed separate groups of Muslims do seem to have this problem with mutual tolerance of difference even between themselves - what do you think would have been a better solution than partition, with all the problems it created at the time? Walk away and leave them all to horrible civil war? Myself, I'd call it making the best of a bad job, and my parents were living in India at the time so were witnesses to what went on. I was born in India only three years after partition, and lived there my first five years, so my parents had plenty of time to observe it all. Yes, people died during partition, but in the grand scheme of things probably rather fewer people than would have been slaughtered in a civil war, and with a fairer distribution of national assets than might have been the case if one group had overwhelmed the other.

 
clack
912292.  Mon May 28, 2012 2:11 pm Reply with quote

Quote:
It's probably at least eight or nine years since it was seriously claimed that Iraq had WMD. It was clearly a pretext for American invasion to protect their oil interests.
Do you have evidence for this assertion?
Quote:
Nobody is arguing that America and other western nations did not essentially create and support the Taliban and Al Qaeda in the beginning.
Many people do indeed argue that the US and other western nations had nothing whatsoever to do with creating and supporting Al Qaeda : http://articles.cnn.com/2006-08-15/world/bergen.answers_1_tora-bora-bin-money?_s=PM:WORLD

 
CB27
912293.  Mon May 28, 2012 2:14 pm Reply with quote

sushil_yadav wrote:
The West needs prescriptions........The highest per capita consumption of psychiatric drugs is in US .........and other Western countries are not too far behind.

Western society is surviving on prescription drugs, illegal drugs, alcohol, cigarettes, coffee and other mind altering chemicals........If these are taken away the whole society would collapse.

India had spent thousands of years in spiritual development......the fields of yoga, meditation and pranayam / breath control were developed to achieve peaceful states of mind.

Dear dear sushi, you do cling on to your hatred.

Let's see:

Drugs - been around for thousands of years, used or medicines, rituals, etc. Animals also use plants and minerals for medicinal purposes.

Illegal drugs - if there is no industry and no central Government to speak of, there's nothing to say anything is legal or illegal.

Alcohol - been around for thousands of years, used not only by humans, but many animals use alcohol.

Cigarettes - Tobacco and other plants have been used by various of cultures for thousands of years.

Coffee - again, used by various cultures for hundreds of years.

As for your comments about India, this just shows what a hateful little troll you are.

Somewhere out there, an unindustrialised village is missing an idiot and are wondering when you'll be back.

 
PDR
912318.  Mon May 28, 2012 5:18 pm Reply with quote

CB27 wrote:

Somewhere out there, an unindustrialised village is missing an idiot and are wondering when you'll be back.


Well I could be wrong, but from the tone of the rants I get the feeling that the judges refused his bail application today, so his village will have to wait for the extradition process to run its remaining course...

PDR

 
CB27
912328.  Mon May 28, 2012 5:57 pm Reply with quote

I get the impression if Lewis Carroll had met sushil, the twins would have been named Tweedledum and Tweedle-even-dumber...

 
sushil_yadav
984782.  Wed Mar 27, 2013 7:30 am Reply with quote

..

Cities are the Graveyards of Nature, Urban Dwellers the Executioners.

Environment has been destroyed by Urban Population, Urban Work and Urban Education.

All Industrial Activity that is destroying environment is being run by Urban Population and Urban Education.

Industrial Activity has destroyed so much environment in 250 years that there is hardly any environment left to save.

Industrial Activity for production of thousands of consumer goods and services must stop immediately....Millions of other species get only food from earth....The maximum that man can/ should get is food, clothing and shelter....Urban Dwellers have to either transform into full time food producers or they have to stop working.

Billions of animals are being slaughtered in Industrial Slaughter Houses every day.....Billions of fish are being killed by Industrial Fishing every day....Millions of acres of Forests are being destroyed by Industrial Activity every day....Millions of wild animals in forests are being killed by Industrial Activity every day.....Millions of tonnes of Solid, Liquid and Gaseous Industrial Waste is being added to environment every day....Millions of tonnes of Metal Waste, Plastic Waste, Chemical waste, Gaseous Waste and eWaste are being added to environment every day.... Millions of acres of Fertile Soil is being killed by Cement, Concrete and Asphalt every day....Nuclear Industry has produced millions of tonnes of Nuclear Waste which will keep contaminating the planet with hazardous radioactivity for the next thousands of years.

Progress, Growth, Development.

This is terminology for all unnecessary and destructive work being done by Urban Population.

Growth Rate - Economy Rate - GDP.

These are figures for all unnecessary and destructive work being done by Urban Population.

If Urban Society stops its supplies to Rural Society it will live forever.

If Rural Society stops its supplies to Urban Society it will die within a month.


If Urban Society stops all its supplies to Villages......electricity, oil, machinery, equipment and consumer goods, Villagers will survive forever.

If Villages stop all their supplies to Cities......Food Grains and Vegetables, Urban Population will die within a month.

[ Villagers need Electricity, Oil, Machinery and Equipment to produce food for the Urban Population , They would not need these things to produce food for themselves]

Urban Work is not only dispensable it is highly injurious to planet earth.

Two centuries of Urban Work after industrialization has destroyed most of the biodiversity and ecosystems on earth.

Urban Work must stop immediately.

Cities, Urban Dwellers, Urban Work and Urban Education are a curse on this planet.

Urban Dwellers are Eco Killers, Eco Murderers and Eco Terrorists.

Urban Dwellers are serial killers of nature....Serial Killers of Animals, Trees, Air, Water and Land.

If consumer goods are eliminated from cities people will not die....If food and water are eliminated from cities people will die.

*Growth Rate* - *Economy Rate* - *GDP*
These are figures of "Ecocide".
These are figures of "crimes against Nature".
These are figures of "destruction of Ecosystems".
These are figures of "Insanity, Abnormality and Criminality".

Urban Population is a curse on this planet....Urban Dwellers are a curse on this planet.

Urban Population has destroyed necessary things [Animals, trees, Air, Water and Land] for making unnecessary things [Consumer Goods and Services]

Food, clothing and shelter are necessities, Not thousands of consumer goods and services.

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For millions of years "Searching For Food" / "Producing Food" were the primary occupations of almost the entire human population in Hunter_Gatherer and Agrarian Society.

There is Zero chance of saving the little environment that is left on earth without fixing the problem of "Urban Population".

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All Urban Dwellers are Eco Killers.....Adults as well as Children.

Urban Adults are already destroying environment by running Industrial Activity for production and marketing of thousands of consumer goods and services......Children are being groomed to do the same in future through Scientific, Technological, Industrial, Business and Financial Education.

School and University Education has destroyed environment....All Industrial Activity is being run by Scientific, Technological, Industrial, Business and Financial Education.


Everything in Cities is destructive in nature......Urban Dwellers, Urban Work, Urban Education.....Everything.

Environment has been destroyed by Urban Dwellers, Urban Work and Urban Education.

The source / cause of all Industrial Activity is Urban Population, Urban Work and Education.

**Urban population trying to save environment is like Petrol trying to extinguish a fire.**

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Rural Population of this world is doing work.....Urban Population of this world is doing destructive work.

Rural Population is producing food......Urban Population is producing thousands of consumer goods and services.

Since Urban Population is not producing food, it has created thousands of unnecessary professions to keep itself occupied [People would go crazy without work]....Destructive works and professions of Urban Dwellers include Production of consumer goods and services, Marketing of consumer goods and services, Jobs in Tourism Industry, Entertainment Industry, Sports Industry, Military Industrial Complex, All kinds of unnecessary research and jobs in hundreds of other fields.

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Why should rest of the world suffer for the decadent and destructive lifestyle of Urban Dwellers????

Why should Forests be destroyed for the Industrial Projects of Urban Dwellers????

Why should Animals and Trees die for the Industrial Projects of Urban Dwellers????

Why should Villages and Tribal Land be destroyed for the Industrial Projects of Urban Dwellers????

Why should Rivers, Lakes and Oceans be destroyed for the Industrial Projects of Urban Dwellers????

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A fraction of world population producing food for entire population....This is the root cause of all environmental destruction.

Rural Population producing food for Urban Population....This is the root cause of all environmental destruction.

Urban Population is not producing food, It is doing *Extra* Work which is causing *Extra* Destruction of environment.....Urban Population is producing thousands of consumer goods and services which has led to *Exponential* Extra Destruction of environment.

All Industrial Activity that is destroying environment is being run and promoted by Urban Population of the world.

Industrialization was the biggest crime on earth....The biggest act of killing, murder and terrorism on earth.

This planet can only sustain "Food Searching" or "Food Producing" Societies.

Hunter_Gatherer Society was sustainable.....Agrarian Society was sustainable.....The question of Industrial Society being sustainable doesn't arise.

We cannot save environment by destroying more of it.....We cannot save environment by destroying it for thousands of consumer goods and services in addition to food, clothing and shelter.
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Animal Species had Zero Percent Urban Population.......Hunter_Gatherer Society had Zero Percent Urban Population.......Agrarian Society had less than Two Percent Urban Population.......All these societies sustained for millions of years collectively.

The current Industrial Society which has 50% Urban Population worldwide has destroyed most of the Biodiversity and Ecosystems in just 250 years after Industrial Revolution.......Industrial Activity has been promoted by Urban Population......Industrial Activity has been promoted by people who do not produce food.

This planet can sustain Animal Species.....It can sustain Hunter_Gatherer Human Society......It can sustain Agrarian Human Society......It cannot sustain Industrial Human Society.

This planet can only sustain food producing societies where almost the entire population is engaged in food production......It cannot sustain an Industrial Society where 50% of world population is growing food for entire population and the remaining 50% living in cities is promoting Industrial Activity.

Animals saved environment for millions of years because they destroyed it only for food.....Hunter_Gatherer Society saved environment because it destroyed environment only for food.....Agrarian Society saved environment because it destroyed environment only for food, clothing and shelter.

Industrial Society has destroyed most of the Biodiversity and Ecosystems because it destroyed environment for "Thousands of consumer goods and services" in addition to food, clothing and shelter.

In the Animal Kingdom, Hunter_Gatherer Society and Agrarian Society almost the entire population was engaged in "Searching for Food" / "Growing Food".

It is the Urban Population that is engaged in and promoting all kinds of Industrial Activity ......Mining Industry, Logging Industry, Energy Generation Industry, Manufacturing Industry, Transportation Industry, Construction Industry, Recycling Industry, Oil Drilling, Oil Refining, Millions of kilometers of Rail & Road network, Air Routes and Shipping Lanes.

Food, clothing and shelter......These are the maximum number of things this planet can provide to humans......The only way to save the remaining environment is by reorganizing the entire population so that food production remains the only primary activity just like it was for millions of years before Industrialization.

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Industrial Society has existed for barely 250 years which comes to almost Zero Percent of Total Human Existence on earth....In fact Industrial Society has existed for only about 100 years....Although Industrial Revolution started 250 years ago most of the world became heavily industrialized only in the last 100 years....100 years of Industrial Activity has destroyed this planet.....100 years of Industrial Activity has destroyed what was not destroyed in millions of years on earth.

Humans have spent more than 99.99% of their time on earth in Non-Industrial Societies [Hunter_Gatherer and Agrarian].....Industrial Society is an Anomaly....Only Non-Industrial Societies are sustainable on earth.

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A pure non-industrial society is not possible now because Industrialization has increased world population to 7 billion.......World population increased from 1 billion in 1800 to 7 billion in just about 200 years after industrialization.......In the absence of industrialization world population would have been less than 2 billion today.

If we want to save the remaining environment we must minimize the things that are destroying environment.

At present we are destroying environment for Food, Clothing, Shelter plus Thousands of Industrial consumer goods and services.

We must eliminate the things that were added last to the list......which means Thousands of consumer goods and services, most of which have existed for only about 100 years out of Hundreds of Thousands of years of Total Human Existence on earth .........these have to be eliminated.

We are approaching Environmental Apocalypse.......The only way to save the remaining environment is by stopping Industrial Activity for production of consumer goods and services immediately........Industrial Activity must be primarily limited to food, clothing and shelter.......and even in these three fields production and consumption must be kept to the minimum.
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sushil_yadav
984786.  Wed Mar 27, 2013 7:52 am Reply with quote

.

Technophiles who ridicule Luddites are the biggest fools.

Luddism is the normality, Industrial Technology is an anomaly.

This world was luddite for millions of years.....Industrial Machines have existed for only 250 years.

Luddism did not destroy Biodiversity and Ecosystems for millions of years.....Industrial Machines have destroyed most of the Biodiversity and Ecosystems in just 250 years.

Animals did not use Industrial Machines for millions of years and did not destroy environment for millions of years.

Hunter_Gatherer Society did not use Industrial Machines for 1 million of years and did not destroy environment for 1 million years.

Agrarian Society did not use Industrial Machines for 10,000 years and caused very limited destruction of environment in 10,000 years.

Industrial Society used Industrial Machines and has destroyed most of the Biodiversity and Ecosystems in just 250 years....In fact Industrial Society has existed for only about 100 years....Although Industrial Revolution started 250 years ago most of the world became heavily industrialized only in the last 100 years....100 years of Industrial Activity has destroyed this planet.....100 years of Industrial Activity has destroyed what was not destroyed in millions of years on earth.

Humans have spent more than 99.99% of their time on earth in Non-Industrial Societies [Hunter_Gatherer and Agrarian].....Industrial Society is an Anomaly....Only Non-Industrial Societies are sustainable on earth.

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PDR
984787.  Wed Mar 27, 2013 7:54 am Reply with quote

Perhaps you could start leading by example by consuming fewer gigabytes of bandwidth in your rants. Learn to summarise, then someone might actually read some of this drivel...

PDR

 
Alfred E Neuman
984796.  Wed Mar 27, 2013 8:38 am Reply with quote

tl;dr

 
'yorz
984797.  Wed Mar 27, 2013 8:41 am Reply with quote

Déjà vu,

 
PDR
984798.  Wed Mar 27, 2013 8:42 am Reply with quote

What again?

 
Alfred E Neuman
984799.  Wed Mar 27, 2013 8:45 am Reply with quote

I suppose, to his credit at he least keeps all his ranting to the one thread.

 
'yorz
984801.  Wed Mar 27, 2013 8:48 am Reply with quote

Unlike many of us ;-p

 
Jenny
984810.  Wed Mar 27, 2013 9:13 am Reply with quote

It seems too obvious to say that given the current population of the world, we're not going to sustain it by hunter-gathering. Moreover, we're not going to sustain it by an agrarian culture. Moreover, you're never going to persuade the half of the world's population that live in urban areas and don't make a living from agriculture to suddenly abandon urban living and till the land.

http://www.prb.org/Educators/TeachersGuides/HumanPopulation/Urbanization.aspx

Quote:
The world has experienced unprecedented urban growth in recent decades. In 2008, for the first time, the world's population was evenly split between urban and rural areas. There were more than 400 cities over 1 million and 19 over 10 million. More developed nations were about 74 percent urban, while 44 percent of residents of less developed countries lived in urban areas. However, urbanization is occurring rapidly in many less developed countries. It is expected that 70 percent of the world population will be urban by 2050, and that most urban growth will occur in less developed countries.


So - how exactly do we plan to kill off three billion people?

Of course if sushil is right, they'll simply starve to death anyway.

 
'yorz
984838.  Wed Mar 27, 2013 9:59 am Reply with quote

Why are people here still engaging in an obviously non-productive dialogue? No new arguments are coming from India - I started reading (well, skimming is the word rather) at page 1 and it all looks boringly identical.

 

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