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The QI Title Music

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Spud McLaren
1289825.  Wed Jul 11, 2018 4:59 pm Reply with quote

GuyBarry wrote:
Spud McLaren wrote:
as previously noted, the chord progression limits the choice of notes in the melody
Well no, it doesn't.
I suppose it depends whether you're writing in a style that doesn't regard (say) a F#/G#/C# progression over a C chord as somewhat Ö unusual.

 
Mr. Hooper
1289844.  Wed Jul 11, 2018 9:26 pm Reply with quote

GuyBarry wrote:
Oh there's a definite similarity - the melodic contour is the same in the first line and the start of the second, though the rhythm is different. The end of the second line is different though.
Yes, you are right. The last two notes of the phrase are different. It's funny - everytime I would watch QI, I would have this sense of kids singing, and I kept going to "It's a Small World," which clearly wasn't the melody. It's not a small world, it's a late night world.

I'm quite sure that Paul Schaffer isn't going to sue anyone, so there's no need for anyone to get defensive.

 
GuyBarry
1289862.  Thu Jul 12, 2018 2:25 am Reply with quote

Spud McLaren wrote:
GuyBarry wrote:
Spud McLaren wrote:
as previously noted, the chord progression limits the choice of notes in the melody
Well no, it doesn't.
I suppose it depends whether you're writing in a style that doesn't regard (say) a F#/G#/C# progression over a C chord as somewhat Ö unusual.


OK, so as a simple example take the so-called "50s progression" (C-Am-F-G, or the equivalent in other keys). Here's a list - by no means complete - of songs containing the progression. Would you say that any of them sound similar melodically?

 
Spud McLaren
1289925.  Thu Jul 12, 2018 12:29 pm Reply with quote

What is your point?

 
GuyBarry
1289934.  Thu Jul 12, 2018 1:29 pm Reply with quote

My point is that if you write two melodies over the same chord progression, they're unlikely to sound similar. That's how so many people start writing new tunes - they borrow someone else's chord progression (which is perfectly legal) and then create a tune over it.

(I tend not to myself, though I'm sure I've done so on occasion.)

 
Spud McLaren
1289942.  Thu Jul 12, 2018 3:28 pm Reply with quote

GuyBarry wrote:
My point is that if you write two melodies over the same chord progression, they're unlikely to sound similar.
But if you write enough tunes to that sequence, some of them will be bound to sound to some degree similar to some others. Which is why this discussion arose in the first place, I believe.

 
GuyBarry
1289945.  Thu Jul 12, 2018 3:38 pm Reply with quote

Well in this particular case, we're talking about two melodies that are very close to each other. The actual notes are identical, as far as I'm aware, up to the second half of the second line. The rhythms are different.

Whether this would count as plagiarism in a court of law I'm not sure.

 
crissdee
1289953.  Thu Jul 12, 2018 5:04 pm Reply with quote

But for us poor schmucks who wouldn't know a chord if it bit us in the leg, they're just two different tunes.

;-)

 
Alfred E Neuman
1289961.  Thu Jul 12, 2018 7:58 pm Reply with quote

GuyBarry wrote:
Well in this particular case, we're talking about two melodies that are very close to each other. The actual notes are identical, as far as I'm aware, up to the second half of the second line. The rhythms are different.

Whether this would count as plagiarism in a court of law I'm not sure.


I donít see that you can separate the melody from the rhythm - isnít a melody a combination of both the pitch and the rhythm?

 
Mr. Hooper
1289963.  Thu Jul 12, 2018 9:53 pm Reply with quote

Alfred E Neuman wrote:
I donít see that you can separate the melody from the rhythm - isnít a melody a combination of both the pitch and the rhythm?
Rhythm and melody are quite different aspects of music. I'm not a composer, but I am a drummer, and I would bet that there are only a handful of songs I could play solo for you on the drums that you would recognize. (Mostly they would be songs with a really novel drum feature that doesn't have anything to do with the melody, like Wipeout.)

Conversely, have you ever heard any jazz? Listen to a jazz cover of a song you know, and even if they play around quite a lot with it, you'll still find the melody very familiar.

Or this song - wihout other cues, would you recognize this: https://youtu.be/5kXcTpWCWyY

Put another way, if there was no attribution to the source, would the original composers have a case if they claimed the song had been stolen from them? What part was stolen?

 
Jenny
1289998.  Fri Jul 13, 2018 10:27 am Reply with quote

Mr. Hooper wrote:


Or this song - wihout other cues, would you recognize this: https://youtu.be/5kXcTpWCWyY

Put another way, if there was no attribution to the source, would the original composers have a case if they claimed the song had been stolen from them? What part was stolen?


Good point - I certainly wouldn't have recognized that until the main theme kicked in around 1.25.

 
Mr. Hooper
1290013.  Fri Jul 13, 2018 11:06 am Reply with quote

Jenny wrote:
Mr. Hooper wrote:


Or this song - wihout other cues, would you recognize this: https://youtu.be/5kXcTpWCWyY

Put another way, if there was no attribution to the source, would the original composers have a case if they claimed the song had been stolen from them? What part was stolen?


Good point - I certainly wouldn't have recognized that until the main theme kicked in around 1.25.
Really? That's interesting - that's the melody of the chorus of the song, which starts at 1:17. Someone more familiar with the original could probably sing along with the lyrics of the intro and first two verses. If you can place where those lyrics would belong, you're identifying the melody.

 
GuyBarry
1290015.  Fri Jul 13, 2018 11:26 am Reply with quote

It's very difficult to make a judgement on that one, because I knew what the song was before I started listening to it, but it started out sounding like "Three Blind Mice" (which is of course the same tune as the first three notes of "All You Need Is Love").

One of the distinctive things about "All You Need Is Love" is the instrumental section between the introduction and the start of the verse (in 7/4 rhythm). This was absent from the piano arrangement, so I'm not surprised if some people failed to recognize the tune.

The partial 7/4 rhythm is one of the most distinctive things about that song, so removing it is bound to make recognition more difficult.

EDIT: It's no good, I've just got to post this now:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SIFzbLE6bHU

 
Mr. Hooper
1290028.  Fri Jul 13, 2018 12:40 pm Reply with quote

GuyBarry wrote:
EDIT: It's no good, I've just got to post this now:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SIFzbLE6bHU
That's great! What a talent he was.

 
Jenny
1290131.  Sat Jul 14, 2018 9:09 am Reply with quote

That is so fantastic! Thanks for reminding me of it, GuyBarry.

 

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