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crissdee
1389051.  Mon Sep 06, 2021 5:25 am Reply with quote

It has more to do with the young crissdee's disinterest in formal education, than with any failure of the system, although the latter probably played it's part...

 
Efros
1389056.  Mon Sep 06, 2021 6:46 am Reply with quote

I can't speak much to the English educational system's History curriculum but I know in Scotland WWII wasn't covered in the time I did history in High School, it would have been covered if I had continued History to O grade or indeed H grade but I abandoned the social sciences in favour of the actual sciences. My knowledge of modern history (i.e. post French Revolution) has come from my own reading etc.

 
Brock
1389084.  Mon Sep 06, 2021 10:54 am Reply with quote

crissdee wrote:
During my wanderings over the weekend, I acquired another "Wiliam" book, William the Detective. This particular edition was printed in 1971, but the first printing was reckoned as being in 1935. All this seems reasonable, but one story concerns William and the gang deciding to become "Nasties", with our hero assuming command as "Him Hitler", so that they may chase the Jewish sweetshop owner out of town and seize his stock. It all ends well, with the boys unwittingly foiling a robbery, and getting huge piles of sweets as a reward, but the details puzzle me.


According to Wikipedia, "William and the Nasties" has been removed from reprints of the book since 1986. You may have something of a collectors' item there!

As to the year when Hitler came to power; I'm pretty sure I didn't learn it at school, as we didn't cover the Second World War. When I did learn it, it's impossible to say; there's been so much coverage of the Second World War and the Nazis in the media during my lifetime that I think I simply absorbed it (like the vast majority of the stuff I know now).

 
AlmondFacialBar
1389103.  Mon Sep 06, 2021 1:54 pm Reply with quote

You... Didn't... Cover WW2... Is it just me or does that explain a whole lot about English foreign policy (and many other English things, too)?

:-)

AlmondFacialBar

 
suze
1389110.  Mon Sep 06, 2021 2:12 pm Reply with quote

I've just asked the good husband about this.

His O level History syllabus covered 1899 to 1963, but covering that period was a fairly new thing and his parents didn't really approve. "That isn't History", they'd say.

Brock and crissdee aren't that much older than he is, but - it would seem - sufficiently much older not to have studied that syllabus.

 
Brock
1389112.  Mon Sep 06, 2021 2:13 pm Reply with quote

I don't have O-level History - it wasn't offered as an option.

I didn't learn any history at school at all from the age of 12. It wasn't an option until you got into the sixth form (which I didn't take up). What I remember from before the age of 12 is mainly about Tudor and Stuart monarchs.

I'm sure there are still huge gaps in my knowledge.

 
AlmondFacialBar
1389114.  Mon Sep 06, 2021 2:21 pm Reply with quote

CRIPES! This side of the Irish Sea there was a massive borderline scandal a couple of years back because it was decided that history should become an elective up to tenth grade. I'm glad to say that it didn't last long and the subject has been back to compulsory since last year. Much as I thought of it as boring in school, if I were back to having to choose my undergrad now, history would probably be one of my minors and I've become convinced that it's necessary for bringing up competent citizens who can make informed political decisions.

:-)

AlmondFacialBar

 
Efros
1389115.  Mon Sep 06, 2021 2:27 pm Reply with quote

History was compulsory, for the first two years of High School in Scotland. At the end of second year you selected 7 subjects to take to O grade. Arithmetic, Maths and English were a must but the other 4 were up to the pupil, in my case they were Biology, Chemistry, Physics and French. This will have changed since then but I'm sure the basic idea is pretty much the same.

 
Brock
1389118.  Mon Sep 06, 2021 2:39 pm Reply with quote

Perhaps you're not aware that I went through the private school system and they could teach more or less what they liked back in those days. I didn't do O-level Geography either - it was offered, but only as an alternative to Latin, and all the bright kids did Latin and looked down their noses at Geography.

Nor did I do O-level Biology - you only did it if you were in the "slow" stream. All seemed perfectly normal back then, but looking back on it now, it's remarkable that so much of the curriculum was considered unimportant.

 
AlmondFacialBar
1389119.  Mon Sep 06, 2021 2:42 pm Reply with quote

Brock wrote:
All seemed perfectly normal back then, but looking back on it now, it's remarkable that so much of the curriculum was considered unimportant.


Yes... I think we can agree on that one... I was glad to learn that Latin is making a comeback on English curricula, mind. I just hope it won't be at the expense of other, equally important subjects.

Christ, every morning I wake up I find myself a tad more conservative about what constitutes a good education...

:-)

AlmondFacialBar

 
crissdee
1389120.  Mon Sep 06, 2021 2:54 pm Reply with quote

Brock wrote:
crissdee wrote:
During my wanderings over the weekend, I acquired another "Wiliam" book, William the Detective.


According to Wikipedia, "William and the Nasties" has been removed from reprints of the book since 1986. You may have something of a collectors' item there!


Kewl!!! I have to admit, I read every volume of William stories that Gants Hill Public Library had to offer, probably multiple times each, but this was a story I had no recollection of at all. Sounds like it was 1 well spent!

 
suze
1389125.  Mon Sep 06, 2021 4:17 pm Reply with quote

AlmondFacialBar wrote:
Yes... I think we can agree on that one... I was glad to learn that Latin is making a comeback on English curricula, mind. I just hope it won't be at the expense of other, equally important subjects.


It's really only a very small comeback.

Yes, a group of about fifty state secondary schools are to be given funding to offer Latin from 11 to 16 as from this time next year. It's very much an experiment and we'll have to wait a few years to see how it works, but the biggest problem is expected to be finding the teachers.

My school isn't involved in that project, but - and as discussed here previously - we are offering A level Latin for one pupil this year. That has only come about because the one pupil wanted to do it, and we already had two teachers who between them are able to deliver it, but I'm not expecting it to happen every year.


AFB wrote:
Christ, every morning I wake up I find myself a tad more conservative about what constitutes a good education.


Welcome to my world!

I am not normally considered a conservative, except when it comes to education.

I didn't write the Education part of UKIP's policy statements for Nigel Farage, but I might as well have done. Even the Conservative Party thinks my stances on Education are elitist and outdated, let alone Labour.

 
AlmondFacialBar
1389127.  Mon Sep 06, 2021 4:43 pm Reply with quote

Thing is... I'm old-fashioned enough to think that education is a vital weapon in the class struggle.

:-)

AlmondFacialBar

 
Awitt
1389128.  Mon Sep 06, 2021 5:34 pm Reply with quote

The Victorian, Australia curriculum in the '90's when I was in my final years, covered history thus: (and meeting a friend at the religious library last November, she reminded me of this medieval era re-enactment, thanks to the history teacher then who did get totally absorbed.)

I also attended a private church school here so can't speak for what the Government schools may have done at the same time.

Year 7, first year of high school - ancient history, Mesopotamia etc
Year 8 - medieval, mostly UK based
Year 9 - Australian including our gold rush (which is also done in primary years)

Year 10 - American including the revolution and causes thereof.

For the final two years it was optional and I can't remember the topics now, but possibly things around the Vietnam war, we had a girl whose dad was a veteran and he came to talk to the class.

 
Jenny
1389195.  Tue Sep 07, 2021 11:05 am Reply with quote

When I was at secondary school, 1961-68, history was compulsory for what is now Y7,8 and 9, and optional thereafter. I took it for O level and A level. None of our curriculum for any of the years I studied it at school included either WW1 or WW2. My O level was Tudor history and History of Building, and my A level was split between American history and the history of working class movements in the 19th century.

But - and this is the killer - I also did history as a minor at university for two years, and American studies as another minor that was split between literature and history, and in none of those years did I study either WW1 or WW2. My entire acquaintance with either has been through the literature of the period, personal interest reading, movies and endless runs of TV documentaries (anybody remember The World At War?)

 

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