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Derbyshire

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Natalie
32044.  Thu Nov 17, 2005 11:32 am Reply with quote

Hmm, so yeah. I must live in Derbyshire, and Derby, and Nottingham. Great!

 
djgordy
32103.  Thu Nov 17, 2005 1:09 pm Reply with quote

More Derby/Derbyshire stuff:

Samuel Plimsoll, famous for drawing lines on the side of ships, was MP for the Borough of Derby between 1868 and 1880. As noted earlier we're about as far from the sea as one can get in Derbyshire so it might seem curious that Plimsoll would be interested in ships, but he was born in Bristol which has something of a greater maritime tradition. On the other hand, we don't have to feel so guilty about the slave trade up here.

Constance Spry, famous for arranging flowers, was born in Derby.

Our most famous artist is Joesph Wright, famous for his painting of the Orrery.

Anthony Babbington, famous for trying to depose good Queen Bess and put Mary Queen of Scots in her place was born in Derby. (When I say 'put Mary Queen of Scots in her place' I mean put her in place of Queen Bess, not give her a good talking to!)

Erasmus Darwin, grandfather of the more famous grandson Charles, lived and is buried in Derby. Erasmus was arguably a more interesting person than Charles, though ultimately less significant. He developed his own theory of evolution which predated that of Lamarck and Charles Darwin, though he didn't think of natural selection. Erasmus' experiments in galvanism inspired Mary Shelley to write Frankenstein. Erasmus Darwin really deserves a thread of his own.

The city of Derby contains areas known as California and New Zealand.

An early UFO was seen on the 14th October 1253 in the skies over the village (now suburb) of Alvaston; which just happens to be where I live*. A bright star emerged from a dark cloud, followed by 2 smaller stars which began to charge the larger one. The larger one reduced in size and sparks appeared. The people were 'stupefied by fear and ignorant of what it might portend' according to the records of Burton Abbey.

Derby boasts the first public park. Although the public had been allowed access to parks generally for years these had always been owned by other people, usually the landed gentry. Derby Arboretum was donated to the people of Derby by Joseph Strutt and opened in 1840.

*Perhaps time travelling aliens were trying to contact me so that I could bring peace, harmony and enlightenment to the galaxy but they overshot by a few hundred years.

 
samivel
32183.  Thu Nov 17, 2005 4:58 pm Reply with quote

djgordy wrote:
Samuel Plimsoll, famous for drawing lines on the side of ships


You'd be given an ASBO for that nowadays

 
eggshaped
32250.  Fri Nov 18, 2005 7:38 am Reply with quote

Maybe he should have got an ASBO. Regarding the Act of Parliament which included the regulation about the Plimsoll-line, not long before a vote was to be taken, Disraeli announced that the Government had decided to withdraw the bill.

Quote:
[Plimsoll] was so shocked and furious that he lost control of himself, flung the word "villain" to the Prime Minister and Government side, and shook his fist at the Speaker of the House of Commons.

The uproar in the House was terrific, but before long it became obvious that the public shared Plimsoll's point of view; he apologized to Mr. Speaker, the bill was passed, and in 1876 it became compulsory for every foreign-going British ship to carry a maximum load line on her side.


http://www.ccg-gcc.gc.ca/usque-ad-mare/chapter09-04_e.htm

 
djgordy
32290.  Fri Nov 18, 2005 9:34 am Reply with quote

Some Derbyshire words and sayings:

'Wrong side o't'brook' - The brook refers to the river Erewash which marks the boundary between Derbyshire and Nottinghamshire, so 'wrong side o't'brook refers to Nottinghamshire. Derbyshire people have no particular emnity with Nottinghamshire folk - as long as they don't support Nottingham Forest.

'Ah'm a Derbyshire man, born and bred, strong i't'arm and wick i't'head'. The first part of this is self-evident. The second part does not mean 'weak in the head' as some people think. Rather, it means quick as in lively, from the Old Englsih Cwick.

'Gnat's cod' - a short distance. Humphret Littleton on I'm Sorry I Haven't a Clue used to refer to a 'gant's crotchet' in the same way.

'Rammel" - worthless rubbish. Probably from ramale, which is latin for a dead bough cut from a tree.

'Frumerty' - A kind of barley gruel. There was a similar word in Hardy's Mayor of Casterbridge, though I don't have a copy to hand to check.

'Brahma' - meaning good. Comes from the Hindu and was brought back by troops serving in India.

'Doolally' - also brough back from India. Meaning mad or crazy it derives from Deolalie near Bombay where troops would wait to be shipped home

 
Jenny
32299.  Fri Nov 18, 2005 9:49 am Reply with quote

Some of these are native to Yorkshire too - my father used to say 'Yorkshire born and Yorkshire bred, strong i'th'arm and weak (not wick!) i'th'head. We also say 'wrong side of the Pennines' to refer to Lancastrians.

'Brahma' and 'doolally' are army terms from India, rather than Derbyshire terms I think. Again, my dad used both of those.

I've heard of 'frumenty', sometimes called 'furmenty', which was a wheat porridge - recipe here. Again, not specific to Derbyshire though, I think.

 
Quaint Idiot
32310.  Fri Nov 18, 2005 10:29 am Reply with quote

And there's flummery, which before meaning flattery was an oat pudding or porridge, from the Welsh word llymru, which I think means just about the same thing. I'm sure Gaazy can correct me if I'm wrong.

 
djgordy
32313.  Fri Nov 18, 2005 10:33 am Reply with quote

Jenny wrote:
Some of these are native to Yorkshire too - my father used to say 'Yorkshire born and Yorkshire bred, strong i'th'arm and weak (not wick!) i'th'head. We also say 'wrong side of the Pennines' to refer to Lancastrians.


Ah! But Yorkshire people are weak i't'head compared to Derbyshire people.

Most sayings and phrases have equivalents in other regions as they will derive from common roots, usually Old or Middle English. It is interesting to see the variations. Derbyshire shares a lot of its dialect with the lesser counties of Leicestershire, Nottinghamshire and South Yorkshire and with instruction, even the most scranny Mester from wrong side o't'brook can be larned t'talk proper.

 
samivel
32417.  Fri Nov 18, 2005 2:01 pm Reply with quote

I think it's 'furmity' in Hardy


Last edited by samivel on Fri Nov 18, 2005 3:43 pm; edited 2 times in total

 
djgordy
32424.  Fri Nov 18, 2005 2:14 pm Reply with quote

samivel wrote:
I think it's 'frumity' in Hardy


Having checked I think it was Frumenty in Hardy.

It is 'fermenty' or 'fromity' in Suffolk.

A version of the Bible printed in 1551 says: '" And ye shall eat neither bread, nor parched corn, nor frumenty of new corne, untill the selfe same daye that ye have brought an offering unto your God." Pharisees 23 v 14.

 
djgordy
32434.  Fri Nov 18, 2005 2:36 pm Reply with quote

This is not unique to Derbyshire but is quite interesting.

In September of 1868 a 14 man cricket squad from the Aboriginal Djabwurrung tribe played a South Derbyshire team. The Djabwurrungs came from the Lake Wallace area of Victoria.

 
samivel
32460.  Fri Nov 18, 2005 3:56 pm Reply with quote

The Oxford Classics edition of The Mayor of Casterbridge has 'furmity', but it may be that other editions use different spellings.

 
geoffo
33737.  Wed Nov 23, 2005 9:17 am Reply with quote



ah bakewell tarts-lovely girls!

 
dr.bob
33772.  Wed Nov 23, 2005 11:21 am Reply with quote

Except in bakewell itself, of course, where the pastry is referred to as a bakewell pudding and therefore the joke doesn't quite work.

Although I believe a bakewell pudding is subtly different from the more commonly available bakewell tart.

 
djgordy
33807.  Wed Nov 23, 2005 12:49 pm Reply with quote

dr.bob wrote:
Except in bakewell itself, of course, where the pastry is referred to as a bakewell pudding and therefore the joke doesn't quite work.

Although I believe a bakewell pudding is subtly different from the more commonly available bakewell tart.


Ok, let's get this right. The pudding made in Bakewell is Bakewell Pudding. The origin of the stuff is here:

http://www.derbyshireguide.co.uk/travel/bakewell.htm

Although some people use the names "Bakewell Pudding" and Bakewell Tart" interchangeably, ths is incorrect.

The Bakewell tart appears to be the invention of a cake maker who shares his surname with the winner of the 1907 Nobel Prize for Literature.

 

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