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Deke
19312.  Sat May 07, 2005 5:09 pm Reply with quote

Birmingham - An Asian pig.


Oh, wait a minute....

Wrong thread.

 
pleasantlydifferent
23598.  Thu Sep 01, 2005 10:56 pm Reply with quote

pleasantlydifferent wrote:
Jenny wrote:
There are 30 other Birminghams around the world and one crater on the moon called Birmingham.

There are suburbs in Birmingham called California, Hollywood and Broadway.


bham in englnd? cos i havnt come across California, Hollywood and Broadway, and i live in birmingham


guess what...i just found tham on a map. sorry.
well, at least i found hollywood...

 
pansophia
24208.  Wed Sep 14, 2005 12:43 pm Reply with quote

[quote="hardie"]
Quote:
Brummie accent is bad for your career


The Birmingham twang is regarded as the worst regional accent in the UK, behind even Liverpool.

http://icbirmingham.icnetwork.co.uk/0100news/0100localnews/content


I shall counter with this article... http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/west_midlands/3187433.stm

Quote:
"Brummie is beautiful


Foreign visitors believe the Brummie accent is attractive
The Birmingham accent is far from its traditional image of "ugly" and "inferior" and is, in fact, regarded as "lilting and melodious" by overseas visitors, academics have discovered.
Researchers at the University of Birmingham found that the second city's much-maligned accent is highly favoured by foreign visitors unaware of the negative connotations the accent holds in Britain.

PhD student Steve Thorne carried out a study examining the way in which "Birmingham English" is perceived by people at home and abroad.

Although the accent regularly comes out bottom in British surveys of favourite regional accents overseas visitors hold it in much higher regard."


My Brummie husband is adored in the US for his accent. But then again, most people think he's from Australia.

 
Jenny
24219.  Thu Sep 15, 2005 7:31 am Reply with quote

Welcome Pansophia!

 
Buckley
33911.  Wed Nov 23, 2005 6:19 pm Reply with quote

Stapes wrote:
This sounds a bit urban-mythy, but apparently there was an underground bus station built under the library area but by the time it was built they realised it wasn't the right size for the new buses which had been ordered, so it was opened as an underground car park for the Council.


There is indeed an underground car park under the Library complex in Birmingham. It is doubtful whether you could park a mini bus in there rather than a bus as numerous council workers with damaged car bodies and scratched paintwork will vouch for.

A much more interesting urban myth is the underground aircraft hangar in Castle Bromwich underneath the old Spitfire factory which, according to legend, still houses Spitfires and is guarded by members of the MOD...

 
Celebaelin
33971.  Thu Nov 24, 2005 2:18 am Reply with quote

*Hackles rise*

Quote:
Tom Stoppard has a joke which is unfortunately about Edinburgh but which would work as well or better for Birmingham, concerning how it shouldn't be regarded as "the Venice of the North" so much as "the Rekjavik of the South".


This is because there is quite a substantial Scandinavian influence in Edinberg, both in the accent and in terms of known ancestry of the 'natives'.

Quote:
pleasantlydifferent wrote:
Jenny wrote:
There are 30 other Birminghams around the world and one crater on the moon called Birmingham.

There are suburbs in Birmingham called California, Hollywood and Broadway.


bham in englnd? cos i havnt come across California, Hollywood and Broadway, and i live in birmingham


guess what...i just found tham on a map. sorry.
well, at least i found hollywood...


California is quite near Harborne. Turn off the Bristol Road in Selly Oak towards The Lazy Fox and then turn left when you reach it, that's Hollywood just along there. I used to live there.

http://www.streetmap.co.uk/newmap.srf?x=402500&y=283500&z=3&sv=402500,283500&st=4&ar=N&mapp=newmap.srf&searchp=newsearch.srf

Broadway is puzzling me a bit except that there are Several Broadways in various places not AFAIK an area itself called Broadway.


Last edited by Celebaelin on Thu Nov 24, 2005 4:51 am; edited 1 time in total

 
Celebaelin
33978.  Thu Nov 24, 2005 3:43 am Reply with quote

JumpingJack wrote:
The word Birmingham is old English meaning ‘the homestead of the people of Beornmund (or Beornma)’. It is often alternatively called Brummagem (the old local pronounciation) from which the slang words Brum and Brummie come.

Birmingham has historically been spelt in numerous ways: Bermingeham (1086); Bremingeham (1166); Brumingeham (1189); Birmingeham (1206); Burmincham (1260); Byrmycheham (1285); Brimygham (1377); Brymycham (1469); Bromecham (1505) and Bromegem (1650).

The transposition of letters or sounds within a word (such as the way the ‘r’ moves around changing the pronounciation from ‘Birm’ to ‘Brum’) is called metathesis.

s: EPN s: OEP

Thus the words of the old song:

Quote:
I lost my heart in Brummagem
Where hunky cable cars
Climbed a minuscule fraction of the way up to the stars.


s: jqm


Birmingham is still know as Brumingum by the people who live there.

JumpingJack wrote:
Despite this, it acquired a reputation for shoddy workmanship, the word brummagem entering English as a synonym for cheap, sham, second-rate or counterfeit.


Do you have a source for this bit?

JumpingJack wrote:
A hammer is also sometimes called a French, Chinese, Jewish or Irish screwdriver.


I’ve heard ‘Navvies’ as well, but not Birmingham or Brummagem.

JumpingJack wrote:
A Brummagem button is a shilling.


(Probably a forged one).

s: SLA


Am I detecting a trend here?

JumpingJack wrote:
Brummie Sayings

I could eat a cock-eyed kid with measles.

If horse muck was pudding nobody would starve.

As drunk as a boiled owl.

As handy as a pig with a musket.

s: bru


Where did you hear these?

As busy as a cat in a tripe shop.

As happy as a dog in a tripe shop?

AKA as fit as a butchers dog.

Jenny wrote:
The first four-wheeled petrol driven car was built by F W Lancaster in Birmingham in 1895. Birmingham now acts as the UK's motor-manufacturing hub (brummm brummmm)


Sadly, no longer true. Only Jaguar remains currently I think.

Quote:
Lunar Society of Birmingham, or the Lunaticks.

The meetings were started by Erasmus Darwin, Matthew Boulton, and William Small. Erasmus was an enormously fat, popular, and successful doctor, a prolific inventor, father of 12 children by his two wives and two more by a governess, and grandfather of the famous Charles Darwin. Boulton was a manufacturer of buckles and a bold entrepreneur. Small was Boulton's doctor and had been teacher and mentor of the great American politician Thomas Jefferson. They were later joined by Charles Darwin's other grandfather, the potter Josiah Wedgwood, chemist James Keir, steam-engine builder James Watt, chemist Joseph Priestley, and several others. In all, there were some 14 members, though not all at the same time. The meetings were held almost every month for more than 30 years. Arguably, there has never before or since been such a regular concentration of scientific intellect meeting under one roof.


http://www.sciencemag.org/cgi/content/full/292/5514/55

Unconfirmed reports suggest that Peter Higgs, the man who has predicted the Higgs Boson is from Birmingham. Unfortunately I’d have to subscribe to the journal to confirm this but if you have access to

Interview with Peter Higgs Conducted by Norman Fancey 1998 Phys. Educ. 33 63-65

You may be able to confirm this. I suppose I could ask an old school friend who is a Professor working on the ATLAS project at the University of Birmingham, it’s been a while since I’ve seen him around town though.

http://atlas.web.cern.ch/Atlas/documentation/EDUC/atlas.html

Beehive wrote:
At a match at Villa Park I was regularly asked over the tannoy "Why do so many people choose to study at the University of Birmingham?"
Answers on a postcard please.


Because simply everybody does dwahrling.

 
eggshaped
34051.  Thu Nov 24, 2005 8:03 am Reply with quote

I belive the word Brummagem meaning "cheap and nasty" can be found in the OED.

Also if you type "Brummagem" and "cheap" into google you get hundreds of sites of this type:
http://www.worldwidewords.org/weirdwords/ww-bru2.htm

Wikipedia says:

Quote:
It is also a term for a cheap and shoddy imitation, in particular when referring to mass-produced goods. This use is archaic in the UK, but persists in some specialist areas in the USA.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brummagem

 
Celebaelin
34073.  Thu Nov 24, 2005 9:52 am Reply with quote

eggshaped wrote:
I belive the word Brummagem meaning "cheap and nasty" can be found in the OED.

Also if you type "Brummagem" and "cheap" into google you get hundreds of sites of this type:
http://www.worldwidewords.org/weirdwords/ww-bru2.htm

Wikipedia says:

Quote:
It is also a term for a cheap and shoddy imitation, in particular when referring to mass-produced goods. This use is archaic in the UK, but persists in some specialist areas in the USA.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brummagem


This should be placed in the context of the Americans being a nascent industrial power not particularly well disposed to the British in general at the time. The import of British manufactured goods was, I have no doubt to be discouraged in favour of buying American.

I'm not going to look for evidence of actual trade tarrifs as that would in no way confirm or deny my suspicions. Plucking a name out of the air BSA stood for Birmingham Small Arms originally. Locally their products were by no means considered to be high quality, whether this was because they were mass produced or whether it was jealousy I can't say.

 
Celebaelin
34076.  Thu Nov 24, 2005 9:59 am Reply with quote

Black Sabbath (OZZ-Y! OZZ-Y! OZZ-Y! All hail his Ozzness!)
Duran Duran
Electric Light Orchestra
Judas Priest
Led Zeppelin (Robert Plant and John Bonham)
Moody Blues
The Move
Napalm Death
The Spencer Davis Group
The Wonder Stuff
Traffic
UB40
Wizzard

Quote:
Dexys Midnight Runners, GBH, Stephen "Tin Tin" Duffy and the The Bureau also emanated from the city's music scene


Quote:
Pop Will Eat Itself, Ned's Atomic Dustbin, The Charlatans, Birdland, Dodgy, Denim, The Lilac Time, and Ocean Colour Scene were other notable rock bands founded in the city and its surrounding area


And from the file marked I'll have to take your word for it...

Quote:
The 90's witnessed an explosion of House music nights supported by local figures such as the late Tony De Vit, Steve Lawler, Scott Bond, Phil Gifford, Jem Atkins and the Ryan brothers. Some of the UK's most influential dance nights have since evolved such as Miss Moneypenny's, Wobble, Fuel, Gods Kitchen, Gatecrasher Club, Sundissential, Fun, Atomic Jam and the original C.R.E.A.M. (Choose right easy and mellow). The city's cultural diversity also contributed to the blend of bhangra and ragga pioneered by Apache Indian in Handsworth.

Electronic and dance music continues to amplify with acts such as Bentley Rhythm Ace, The Streets, Rockers Hi-Fi, The Editors, Surgeon, Mistys Big Adventure, and Broadcast. Large alternative electronic nights take place in the Custard Factory such as Trigger and Earko with many pioneering new DJ's captivating hundreds of revellers.

 
JumpingJack
34083.  Thu Nov 24, 2005 11:07 am Reply with quote

Celebailin

I'm not quite sure what you're saying (or asking).

We did a lot of research on Brum for the 'B' series. Do you doubt the quality of the work? Or are you just surprised by it?

Nobody knows everything about their home town (or even about the members of their own family).

The information was presented without comment, it's not a dig at Birmingham particularly.

Brummagem as a synonym for 'shoddy' or 'counterfeit' is widely known – and was widely used, tho' maybe not in Birmingham. The definition comes from the OED (1933 Edn. reprinted 1978).

I can't say if it was fair or not, nor did I.

'Birmingham screwdriver' comes from the Dictionary of Slang by Jonathon Green (Cassell, 1998).

I found the colourful Brummie sayings here:

www.ebrummie.co.uk/brummie_phrases.htm

(though many of them are out of fashion now I would think).

Nuff?

 
Celebaelin
34132.  Thu Nov 24, 2005 12:37 pm Reply with quote

Quote:
I found the colourful Brummie sayings here:

www.ebrummie.co.uk/brummie_phrases.htm

(though many of them are out of fashion now I would think).


Not that many of them it seems! Ah, the colourful local badinage of a sadly grey city. I rather suspected that that was book-learnin'.

I'll not deny getting the hump at the fact that, er, exclusively as far as I can recall, the first dozen posts or so all seemed to have negative connotations. It seemed selective. Mine is a kind of knee jerk reaction of the sort you always get when somebody consistently disparages someone/thing that you are fond of. It provokes a sort of "hmmm, unhappy love affair perhaps" assumption from me. To appologise for allowing my bias to show is the best I can do in this regard I'm afraid.

I was actually hoping that all was well and in jest and that any such remarks were to be taken and given in good part, although the implication that there was a government report that made note of the Brummagem thing really did get my back up.

I don't doubt that you thoroughly researched everything you wrote, but you did misrepresent (or omit) your sources didn't you? C'mon now?

Perhaps the cliche of least said soonest mended should apply.

 
JumpingJack
34143.  Thu Nov 24, 2005 1:02 pm Reply with quote

Sorry, Celebailin, but I neither misrepresented nor omitted my sources.

Posting sources is a rule I made for the site and I am one of the very few people here who consistently adheres to it.

The Brummie phrases site appears to be defunct, but I can hardly be blamed for that. It was there at the time I posted the information.

The others are three-letter shortcodes that I use so as not to have to type out long lists of book titles every single time. You're entitled to ask for what they mean, of course, and I've told you.

If some of the material about Birmingham is negative, that's because every town, country, person, planet and furry little animal in the universe has its downside.

One of the research team in the B series lived (and still lives) in Birmingham and was at pains to point out the positive side of the city. As was I. And everyone else on the thread. We all learned a lot from the experience – good and bad.

QI is not here to deal in clichés or to make moral judgments, that's not our job. But nor or are we here to whitewash anyone or anything.

All we're trying to do is make life a little more interesting.

 
JumpingJack
34154.  Thu Nov 24, 2005 1:17 pm Reply with quote

Sorry to snap, by the way, Celebailin

Immense amounts of work have gone into creating these threads and, as the site has become more popular, much of one's time seems to be taken up with defending attacks on our veracity – rather than advancing the work itself.

As has been said frequently before on these boards, we don't claim to be flawless but we are doing our level best to be as accurate as the technology (and our diligence) allows.

And thank you for your pacific post.

Pax, I hope, eh?

 
Celebaelin
34161.  Thu Nov 24, 2005 1:23 pm Reply with quote

Firstly, sorry, OK the three-letter shortcodes are there.

But secondly, sorry but no, you placed the Brummagem comment sandwiched between two pieces of information taken from the government report.

Not only that but the report you reference is at pains to point out at an early stage that

Quote:
The Birmingham General Cemetery Company was founded in 1832 and the Cemetery at Key Hill was opened to all creeds and denominations in 1836, although in practice it was used mainly by non-conformists.


and

Quote:
In England, the first urban cemetery was established in Liverpool's Derby Road, in 1825; followed by Kelsall Green, in 1833, in London. Thus Birmingham was very much at the forefront of the movement.


Whereas what you chose to reference was:

Conditions were crowded and unsanitary and typhoid and cholera were rife. The churchyards rapidly became overpopulated and sextons resorted to the use of "boring rods" probing the soil to find space for one more body.

This despite the fact that what the report actually says is that the new graveyard was built because:

Quote:
Cholera and typhoid endangered the lives of all classes. The church yards of six Anglican burial grounds in the town centre and those for the Jews, Quakers, Baptists and Congregationalists and Methodists were overflowing. The sexton had to have recourse to the "boring rod" to find space for one more body.


as was the case, or effectively so, in all the cities mentioned.


Last edited by Celebaelin on Thu Nov 24, 2005 2:08 pm; edited 1 time in total

 

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